Snow Queen Discussion Post
I did a guest post for author Mindy Klasky’s “Inside Track” feature, talking about some of the things that went into Snow Queen. That post went live yesterday, and includes a giveaway for the book. Details on Mindy’s blog or LiveJournal.
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Given some of the comments and e-mails I’ve been getting, I figured it was time to put together an open discussion post for The Snow Queen’s Shadow [Amazon | B&N | Mysterious Galaxy].
This should go without saying, but just in case…
THERE WILL BE SPOILERS IN THE COMMENTS!
I’m happy to answer questions or talk about the story, but I’m also happy to shut up and let folks chat. If you’d like me to jump in, just say so.
In other words, if you say, “Hey Jim, why did you have to go and have Elvis kill Prince Armand?” I’ll try to answer you. If you say, “I hate that Elvis killed Armand in a shoe duel. Glass slippers should have the advantage over blue suede shoes!” then I’ll probably stay out of it.
My thanks to everyone who’s e-mailed me, Tweeted, posted reviews, and generally just talked about the book!
Rens
July 13, 2011 @ 10:39 am
I had a semiformal bet with a few friends as to whether Talia and Snow would wind up together in this book.
We’ve been disputing whether Grace ‘counts’ or not ever since we read it.
Jim C. Hines
July 13, 2011 @ 10:43 am
I’d be happy to give you an official authorial response for a cut of the winnings 😉
Renee
July 13, 2011 @ 12:18 pm
I just loved the way you stuck it to the Duchess in the end!! Didn’t want Snow to die, but then maybe that’s why I’m not an author- all my books would be sappy and boring, not interesting and heart wrenching and meaningful.
Would love to see more in the future- maybe when Jakob grows up and finds his princess…:)
Courtney
July 13, 2011 @ 12:21 pm
I loved this book. It was really creative how you combined Snow White with the Snow Queen; I never realized that they had so many things in common, particularly the magic mirrors. A few things:
1) You killed Snow? WHY????
2) I get that the character of Gerta was based on the girl from the Snow Queen, but did you create her so that Talia could end up with Snow? I guess I understand that Talia/Faziya couldn’t last, but I honestly thought Talia had moved past Snow…
3) Are there any other fairy tales out there that you would have liked to include in the series?
Jim C. Hines
July 13, 2011 @ 1:11 pm
I’ve actually thought about doing a YA series which pairs a somewhat older Prince Jakob with a princess from Fairytown, but I don’t think it’s something I’ll be able to do unless I find a way to ditch the day job. There’s just not enough time in the day.
And thank you! The one thing I wanted was to make sure Snow’s death was meaningful. That even though it sucked, and I hated writing it, her death was also a victory for her…
Jim C. Hines
July 13, 2011 @ 1:16 pm
Thank you! I loved how well The Snow Queen fit with what I wanted to do with this book…
1) Because … well, because every time I wrote it differently, it felt like I was cheating. Like I was letting her live because I didn’t want her to die, not because it was what was right and true to the story. Like a dungeon master fudging dice rolls because I don’t want to kill off a favorite character.
2) Heh. No, Talia hadn’t completely moved past Snow. She was starting to come to terms with things, but those feelings were still there. Re: Faziya, Talia loves them both. Her feelings for Snow don’t stop her from loving Faziya, and I think both she and Faziya were aware that this wasn’t permanent, and were okay with taking what time they could together.
3) I had thought about bringing in Rapunzel, probably as a smaller bit like Hansel and Gretel, but when Disney did their movie, I tossed that idea away. It would have felt a little too imitative to me.
Beka
July 13, 2011 @ 2:25 pm
A few questions for one of my fave authors!
1) Be honest, how much fun was it to combine the stories of Snow White and The Snow Queen? (link for those who might not know that one) ‘Cause I seriously adored seeing all the little links to that story, it was one of my favourites when I was little.
2) How did you come up with the idea for Gerta? Is there anything interesting about her that you created and never got to use in the final draft?
3) When you were trying to keep from killing Snow, what sorts of ways did she end up not dying?
4) Sort of related, was there ever a time when Gerta didn’t survive, and why did you ditch it? (Sorry, I have a serious love of knowing “the way it DIDN’T happen”)
5) It sort of seemed to me that when you wrote The Mermaid’s Madness, you were figuring on the series being longer and more about OTHER fairy tales than the girls, and then when you started Red Hood’s Revenge you realised that you’d dealt with Danielle’s past and demons and you needed to deal with Talia and Snow’s as well (quite literally, in Snow’s case). Is that the case? Was The Mermaid’s Madness a bit of extra story before the inevitable conclusion or was it the remnant of a previous series plan? Am I far too nosy for someone you don’t even know?
6) How does it feel to know that your writing had me a crying mess in the waiting room of a doctor’s office? 😉
Seriously, though, it was a fabulous book and a good conclusion to the series – with Snow gone and Danielle the queen, they can’t exactly have romps across the world, can they? I wish Snow could’ve survived, but like you said – letting her live would’ve been cheating. It would’ve been fantastic but at the same time it would’ve robbed the ending of the book of the wonderful depth of emotion it carries. I wish that there could be more stories, though – I love the girls, I love the universe, it’s just… too wonderful to let go. I am secretly plotting ALL THE FANFIC, though I doubt I’ll end up writing any of it. I just love thinking about what the other stories really are. Rapunzel, maybe, or Beauty and her Beast…
TheBloke
July 13, 2011 @ 2:43 pm
Well here it is, the blog I waited for, mostly out of interest what others would have to say.
I already e-mailed you my thoughts so that will have to do.
Feel free to put them up for discussion if you like.
I`m getting over the ending so it still stings a bit.
Jim C. Hines
July 13, 2011 @ 3:17 pm
Okay, let’s see how many of these I can get through 🙂
1) It was awesome! I loved how well Anderson’s tale intersected with the story I wanted to write. It fit nicely enough that I suspect I may in fact be Hans Christian Anderson, and at some future date will invent time travel so I can go back in time and write the fairy tale to set up my book.
2) Will have to think of this. Gerta didn’t go through any huge changes, though.
3&4) One way was to recombine her with Gerta, either creating a new personality or “overwriting” Gerta. Another was for Gerta to die, but somehow save Snow in the process. Neither felt right. Even if Snow could have done that, she would have been destroying what had become a real person…
5) I knew I wanted to write Mermaid for book number two, but originally the series was going to be a little more episodic. Things like Talia’s love for Snow made me realize I was working with longer plot arcs, which changed the way I wrote the books, but I think Mermaid probably has a little more of that episodic feel to it.
6) Slightly guilty, but also rather proud. It means something I wrote, characters I created, had a powerful impact on a reader, and what more could an author want? 🙂
I imagine Talia and Gerta are having some romps, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they brought Danielle along for a few… I definitely think Danielle will continue to settle into her role as queen, but — just like Beatrice (at least in my unwritten backstory for her) — that doesn’t mean she’ll *always* sit at home while the others have all the adventures.
Beka
July 13, 2011 @ 3:38 pm
1) You know, re-reading the story I picked up like a hundred more references – the big scroll, the writing on the fish, the progression of people the girls encounter on their search for Snow… Dude, I LOVE YOU.
5) Haha! I was so right, yes? Yes! I don’t fault Mermaid at all for being more episodic, I loved it. I was always kind of shocked that the Little Mermaid WASN’T bitter and angry in the original, I think I like your version better.
6) Considering I would consider it the hugest compliment in the world if someone told me my writing had literally brought them to tears, I totally know what you mean.
Haha, oh man, I wish you could write a novel about Bea when she was younger. I loved her so much, she was just so full of AMAZING.
Jim C. Hines
July 13, 2011 @ 3:43 pm
1) ::Grin::
5) When I first read Anderson’s “The Little Mermaid,” I got to the end, pushed back from the computer, and said, “Oh, HELL no!” I *had* to do something with that one…
Re: Bea, one of the most frustrating things for me has been the realization that I’ll never live long enough to write all the books I want to write. DAMN YOU, MORTALITY!!!
Beka
July 13, 2011 @ 3:48 pm
5) Yeah, one of the few times I think the Disney version MAKES MORE SENSE. She’s not bitter because he does love her! It was an enchantment and a mistake and in the end they got to live happily ever after after all! Not “wait… you mean you’re… but… WTF‽” like the original.
I’m now picturing you screaming “MORTALITY!” like Kirk screaming “KHAN!” and I’VE NEVER WATCHED STAR TREK. Ah, the power of internet geekery and memeing. Also, it’s a hilarious mental image.
David Y
July 15, 2011 @ 9:36 pm
Jim:
I just checked the story gain today, and it’s not explained how Armand becomes king. There’s no mention of his father dying (that I can find).
So the Princesses are done; will we get a series of the half-fairy prince? (“I am a fairy down to the waist….”)
Jim C. Hines
July 15, 2011 @ 10:14 pm
David – it’s on page 326, about halfway down. (There’s another quick reference at the very top of page 331.) Theodore is still alive, but chose to step down.
I actually considered doing a YA series about Prince Jakob, maybe with a princess from Fairytown. But unfortunately, I don’t have the time to do more than one book a year, and I’m also contracted for a new series. Too many stories, too little time…
Ali
July 18, 2011 @ 9:40 am
Okay, I LOVED the book. It may be my favorite from the Princess series, even though it made me cry.
When I was reading, I was so torn. I wanted Snow to live, but I didn’t want Gerta to die. I think you made the absolute best choice — which wasn’t the easiest one.
I love Danielle as Queen — and I really like the scene toward the end, where the girls reminisce about Snow. That rang so true, sitting around and telling stories of the dead like that.
The memorial garden gave me pause (it was a neat touch). My first reaction was, “I wonder is someone would ever try and resurrect Snow’s mother from the obelisk, since it was made with her ashes.” Although, I loved that Snow was “buried” there, too. Very touching.
In short, wonderful book. If I get time, I’m going to blog about later on this week.
Jim C. Hines
July 18, 2011 @ 1:58 pm
“I wonder is someone would ever try and resurrect Snow’s mother from the obelisk, since it was made with her ashes.”
Given that both the first book and this one involved Snow’s mother as a villain in one way or another, I doubt I’d ever write a third book using her that way.
But that’s a fascinating idea… 🙂
Erin K
July 18, 2011 @ 9:14 pm
Jim:
Thank you so much for the gift Snow Queen was. I feel like a lot of authors would have shied from the ending. I kinda read the whole story with a knot in my throat because I knew there was no going back. It broke my heart to have Snow so.. Snow like in the first chapter!
Well done in every way. It has been an amazing journey!
-Erin
Erin K
July 18, 2011 @ 9:16 pm
Also I meant to add – Having lost my best friend – the scene with Snow, Greta and Talia was A+. You laugh, you cry and you drink. It’s very healing.
Jim C. Hines
July 18, 2011 @ 10:02 pm
Thanks, Erin. The spirit of that last scene was based on a night about 20 years ago, when a few of us learned a friend had been killed in a car accident. The emotional pattern, the shared stories and grief, it was very similar to what happens in that last chapter of the book.
Ali
July 19, 2011 @ 8:22 am
*taking that a step further* Someone could (in theory) resurrect Snow, if there was proper cause. Not “oh, we missed her!” But a good, solid reason. And I’m plotting your characters. lol This book really did make me think.
Kate
August 15, 2011 @ 5:28 am
Hi, I’m dropping by this post, oh, a month late because I’ve only just had the luck to have The Princess Series in my life. Like Pringles, once I popped I couldn’t stop and I’ve read the four of them in the last couple of weeks, only delayed by the fact that the second two weren’t available on Kindle in the UK and for some reason Red Hood took longer to ship to me than Snow Queen. Those were nerve-wracking days of waiting, I can tell you. I just wanted to thank you for four incredible books both from story and brilliant female protagonists perspectives. Besides the great characters and the fabulous storytelling there was a background thing you did that made me very happy. I don’t know how deliberately you chose to do this, but a lot of your ‘stock’ characters were female. The default in most media tends to be male and so that’s how we see the random police officer or the doctor or the troll or whatever and so the circle of continues and that’s why it was so obvious in your books that you were doing something else. Every time a bit player was female it made me grin. So easy to do and yet so rarely done.
I knew what was coming with Snow from early on in the last book because I couldn’t see how you would have any other way out of it, but it still hurt like a fist in the stomach. I think it’s a mark of how complex and well-drawn the characters were that it made it impossible for there to be a happy ever after for all three of the princesses. Also, I loved that the books began with the what-happened-next of Cinderella and widened out to embrace the what-next? of the other princesses and fairy story characters, but ended with the creation of a new fairy tale in The Snow Queen and you could see how retellings and retellings and time and distance would soften it into the story we all know.
Again, thank you. These books have made me happy (and worried and sad and tense and excited and amused and…) and I can’t wait to recommend them to anyone who’ll stand still long enough.
Jim C. Hines
August 15, 2011 @ 9:19 am
Thank you, Kate. I really appreciate it, and I’m so glad to hear how much you appreciated the books.
I think we’ll eventually get the territorial issues sorted out regarding e-books, but right now that’s a bit of a mess. I can see where the problems are coming from, but I also want readers to be able to get books with as little difficulty as possible. I’m hoping we’ll be able to do a U.K. edition of my next book, which would simplify things.
Thanks again for making me smile this morning 🙂